Interview - The Author 2.0

Sebastian Schöbel from Süddeutsche-Magazin was kind enough to interview me about publishing, authors, podcasts and 'Author 2.0'. You can find the article here.

Literature | 26 November 2009

Christian Heinke put his first novel online as a free podcast in 2005 - and at times had more listeners than the Tagesschau podcast. A hopeful conversation about the future of literature in the Internet age.

By Sebastian Schöbel (Interview)

Mr Heinke, you have more listeners than readers with the podcast for your debut novel “Die Haut”. Sounds plausible, since you come from radio.

Christian Heinke: That’s right, my initial goal was to get a job at Westdeutscher Radio Broadcaster (WDR). I suggested »Die Haut« as an audio book. But they informed me that being an established or experienced author was a requirement. But I’m just a mixture of both, which wasn’t enough. I was just too unknown.

How did you become a podcast author?

I set up my first podcast early, in 2005. That was the story with which I failed at WDR. That was exactly the year Apple iTunes appeared with support for podcasts, and that catapulted me forward. The podcast went online in May 2005, and in July I skyrocketed to the top ten in the iTunes charts, ahead of the Tagesschau. The podcast had several thousand downloads in its heyday. But even at a later time, it continued to be downloaded a few hundred times a day. That motivated me because I knew I could also make a name for myself outside the established media.

How did you react to the success?

I was truly amazed at how you can effortlessly reach such a massive community. I’ll never forget how I unexpectedly found myself on the Apple website because the company wanted to market the new podcast medium. Having offered my manuscripts numerous times before, I now had the feeling that I had stumbled upon the right idea at the perfect time.

Did the broadcaster get in touch again after your success?

Yes, soon afterwards they asked if I wanted to do something about podcasts. But at first, they didn’t even have the technical requirements to make a quick MP3. Instead, I could produce my own contributions for radio. In the meantime, of course, it has become standard practice for contributions to be available as podcasts.

But WDR didn’t want your novel as a podcast either?

No, no, I’m too unknown for that. I still am today; I was only relatively successful in the podcast scene, which is why I was passed around a lot there.

What happened next to you?

A small Swiss publishing house I had already been in contact with was apparently so convinced of my success that they took me on.

You’ve already brought potential readers with you.

Exactly, and that’s also the fresh approach to the podcast novel. However, I had to give my publisher a contractual assurance that I wouldn’t tell my novel right to the end in the podcast. So, I don’t reveal the ending.

What did your fans say about this?

Of course, this has led to some frustration among my first-time listeners, but just the other day a reader tweeted me: “So, reading now”; with a picture attached showing him holding the book in his hands. So I could persuade some listeners to buy the book.

Is the crime novel a great genre for the podcast?

I think that works that are structured differently than the sequential crime novel could have difficulties. I looked for the medium that suited me. I’m very influenced by Anglo-American culture: short sentences, quick scene changes, plus my film background.

Has the podcast influenced your writing style?

The manuscript for “The Skin” wasn’t quite finished yet when I started the podcast. The podcast continued despite the manuscript not being quite finished yet. That’s why I also integrated plot highlights into the structure so that the listener doesn’t get disappointed. That expands my writing. “The Heart” is slower and less violent than “The Skin”. I’ll add music to narrative passages in the podcast to keep the listener engaged.

Would you have responded to readers’ requests and changed the text?

Listeners don’t go that far. The consumer attitude prevails. You sometimes get a “I like” or “I don’t like” in response, but most listeners just want to know when it’s going to continue. Directly I have received none direct instructions - I don’t think people want that either.

How well has “Die Haut” sold in the meantime?

The print run was only about 5000 books, and it’s not sold out yet. But my publisher is happy, it’s one of their bestsellers. But of course I won’t reach the bestseller lists with it.

Is it even possible to earn money from the free culture on the Internet?

I think it’s important for unknown authors to get their name out there on the Internet, generate potential customers themselves, and eventually be bought in shops. Just because it’s free on the Internet doesn’t mean that you can’t earn money with it later. My experience is that people who have heard me read are prepared to spend money on me and buy my book.

Do you believe your fans will remain loyal to you even if you charge small amounts for the podcast, so-called “micro-payments”?

I don’t think micro-payments work except as a small contribution.

They might cover the production costs, but that’s about it. Selling the novel as an iPhone application is another possibility. You could charge two to three euros for this, which is about equivalent to my income from selling the book. “The Skin” is also available as an e-book, so that’s another option I’m focussing on. But an electronic book has to be much cheaper than a printed one.

Where is the price limit?

I’m torn between the two. Of course, you can’t produce a successful novel for 99 cents. But I believe that the marketing structure is changing: It costs nothing to store and send data. If publishers are clever enough and implement an appropriate pricing policy, everyone can make money from it. I just believe that people are not prepared to pay a high price for an e-book, because their competition is not with other publishers, but with Pirate Bay.

Did you vote for the Pirate Party?

Yes, I voted for them. I voted for them to make a statement because I was dissatisfied with the established parties and their stance on copyright on the Internet. I was also annoyed by their behavior towards the Internet: Keyword “ZensUrsula”. Child pornography is being used as an excuse to establish a censorship on the Internet, which is bad for our democracy.

Don’t the Pirates stand for free culture?

No. The Internet should be accessible to everyone, but above all, there should be no censorship. I don’t want to promote a free culture.

You will publish your next book, “The Heart,” at the end of the year - a continuation of the trilogy about New York policewoman Helen Louisiani. Will there be another podcast about it?

Yes, there will be. I sat down last weekend and recorded the first chapter. Now I need to edit it, and then I can publish it simultaneously with the book.

Were there any conditions from the publisher?

The publisher is hesitant to make the entire novel available online, as it would interfere with releasing an audio book later.

Sounds like an essential conflict: either you sell books and earn money, or you have the podcast and maintain direct contact with readers. Does that work together?

I believe that the world is changing, that we are experiencing the beginning of a new era. I sometimes sit down with crime writers who are not so close to the new media, and you notice big differences.

They want to keep things the way they are. But in the long term, the publishing world will change and I just have to be patient. A lot has happened to me in the past four years. Today I’m publishing my second novel - I never thought that would happen. Of course, I would like to be a bestselling author. I’d be happy if Denis Scheck threw me in the bin because he rubbished my book, but until then I’m just going my own way.

You can find the link to Christian Heinke’s podcast on his website.

KaMeRu Verlag published his novel »Die Haut« and also made it available as an eBook.